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THE MOMENT OF TRUE.

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8 months 3 weeks ago - 8 months 3 weeks ago #32339 by Kawboy
Replied by Kawboy on topic THE MOMENT OF TRUE.
A transistor is an amplification device meaning that there's a relationship between the base voltage and the emitter voltage. When you load the base to maximum output, the emitter / collector are at 100%, so when you turn on / off the base voltage, the transmitter becomes a switch.

A Darlington is a transistor that is in series with the Base of a second transistor. When this is done the step up between the base output of the first transistor to the emitter of the second transistor can be as high as 100 to 1. That why they designed the Darlington transistor as a power transistor.
The latest replacement for Darlington transistors is the Eccospark IGBT transistors. They are all fine and dandy when the signal to the base is a digital voltage of 5 volts usually coming from an ECU.

The Huco 13-8001 igniter has in it a L-484 chip which takes the VR sensor AC volts (5 - 8 volts) and converts it to a digital 5 volt DC signal to energize the base of the transistor. All of the HEI igniters have a similar process, meaning they all take a VR sensor voltage and manipulate it to operate the transistor. That's why the HEI igniters are the cat's ass for replacing the igniter on the KZ1300. You can get HEI igniters for $15 up to $143 for the Pertronics HEI  III multispark igniter. It's magic. Also,  the HEI Igniters were designed to control HEI ignition coils which are 1 ohm primary resistance so driving 2.2 ohm ignition coils is not a problem as far as possible overloading the transistors, although the dwell time set in the HEI igniter might be a touch short when using the 2.2 ohm coils, meaning the coils may not fully build up the magnetic field. A 2-3 ohm coil wants around 8 miliseconds to build up the magnetic field and a 1 ohm coil wants about 3.5 miliseconds to build the magnetic field

What's interesting is in a wasted spark system, the spark is generated once per rpm, so at redline in our bikes (8500 rpm) , each coil has to generate 8500 sparks per minute. 60 seconds devided by 8500 = 7.05 miliseconds, so the only way to achieve a complete spark in less than 7.05 milliseconds is to shorten the dwell to less than 7.05 milliseconds. In the back of my mind I have it that Daro measured the stock dwell at 6 milliseconds which would make sense.
Now maybe you can appreciate why bikes like the 600 Ninga have coil on plugs which fire every other stroke. The ZX6R redlines at 16K rpm so the coils fire 8000 times per minute, so now we're back to 7.05 miliseconds but the coil on plug coils are less than 1 ohm resistance so they only need 3.5 milliseconds dwell for full magnetic field buildup. That means there's lots of time to develop a high output spark and the coil on time is around 50%.

Electronics- a field unto itself. I've spent days trying to understand it all and I think I have enough of the fundamentals down so I can proceed. with my work.
Last edit: 8 months 3 weeks ago by Kawboy.
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8 months 3 weeks ago #32340 by biltonjim
Replied by biltonjim on topic THE MOMENT OF TRUE.
I think my choice would be to buy the modern Carmo unit. Apart from being new and covered by a three years warranty, the claimed benefits it has over the Kawasaki igniter make it more appealing.  I assume it will fit on the bike  in the originally designed location.

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8 months 3 weeks ago - 8 months 3 weeks ago #32341 by kawaBCN
Replied by kawaBCN on topic THE MOMENT OF TRUE.
Last night I sent an email requesting a quote from the people at Carmoelectronics indicating the model and year of my motorcycle. I also told them that I had installed some new coils from Spareparts that dispensed with the stone resistance.

I'm still waiting for their response.

Meanwhile today I received the order for parts from France.

The airbox part I didn't have.



The chrome headlight ring, mine has holes from rust and is painted with the same fucking water-based paint that was painted on the engine.



The complete radiator protector, with its grille, anchors, screws and corresponding rubber bands.

If one day I decide to sell this motorcycle I am going to break with the tradition that every time a motorcycle changes owners, parts are lost.


The entire lot plus shipping costs cost me the "modest" amount of 350 euros after the seller gave me a discount imagining my stupid face willing to pay for those items.

RUN LIKE THE WIND¡¡¡
Last edit: 8 months 3 weeks ago by kawaBCN.

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8 months 2 weeks ago #32345 by kawaBCN
Replied by kawaBCN on topic THE MOMENT OF TRUE.
I have received a response from Carmoelectronics.

I told you in an email about the coil change I made on the bike, I replaced the original ones with some from the Spareparts brand performance model, eliminating the use of the stone resistor as it has a 3.5 ohm output.

Well, their answer is that their CDI has not been tested with this model of coils and they do not assure me that the motorcycle works correctly.
They also respond to me that if the product does not work, they will not refund the amount of money paid.

The question is:

Has anyone assembled that Carmoelectronics CDI with the Spareparts performance coils?

RUN LIKE THE WIND¡¡¡

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8 months 2 weeks ago - 8 months 2 weeks ago #32350 by Kawboy
Replied by Kawboy on topic THE MOMENT OF TRUE.

I have received a response from Carmoelectronics.

I told you in an email about the coil change I made on the bike, I replaced the original ones with some from the Spareparts brand performance model, eliminating the use of the stone resistor as it has a 3.5 ohm output.

Well, their answer is that their CDI has not been tested with this model of coils and they do not assure me that the motorcycle works correctly.
This is a terrible answer for your question. Carmo designed / built a replacement igniter that was compatible with the stock coils and they should have identified that when you install the Carmo unit, you either have to use the ballast resistor or not use the ballast resistor. That's point #1.

The stock ignition coil primary resistance is between 1.2 - 1.9 Ohms
The stock ballast resistor  resistance is between  1.5 - 1.9 Ohms
Doing the mathematics, that means the stock ignition coil primary resistance total can range between  1.2 + 1.5 = 2.7 Ohms  to 1.9 +1.9 = 3.8 Ohms. 

Carmo should have told you that their igniter was designed for a primary ignition circuit resistance of either 1.2 - 1.9 Ohms if the ballast resistor is not used or, if they require the ballast resistor to be used the primary ignition circuit has to fall between  2.7 - 3.8 Ohms. That's point #2

Why is the primary ignition circuit resistance so important?

When the resistance in a circuit is low, it allows more electrons to flow which can overheat the components in the circuit and cause a failure .
If the resistance is too high, it will not flow enough electrons ( in this case) to build up the required magnetic field in the coil to produce a healthy spark


They also respond to me that if the product does not work, they will not refund the amount of money paid.

The question is:

Has anyone assembled that Carmoelectronics CDI with the Spareparts performance coils?
You might get a response from the members on the Facebook sites regarding this question since most of them are European. The Carmo igniter is known to the members of KZ1300.com but as far as I know, non of them have bought / used the Carmo unit.
Last edit: 8 months 2 weeks ago by Kawboy.

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8 months 2 weeks ago #32352 by tackelhappy
Replied by tackelhappy on topic THE MOMENT OF TRUE.
As the cost of the Carmo ignitor is very similar to the oem, then maybe a better option is the oem .
Over the years , owners have used many types of coil packs, - Accel, Nology, GM car coils, KZ 1000, Dyna's - the list is long .
Each bike I have has ended up with a different coil set-up, no ballast resistor and oem ignitor on all of them.

" If you can't say what you think, very soon you won't be able to think !
OKANAGAN FALLS. BC ,Canada

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