Installing water pp cover and thermostat... hints/tips

Kawboy wrote:

So I'll recap and save you the trouble of finding the leak paths etc.

First, most likely the primary leak you have is the Lubriplate on the seal faces. Seal faces are lapped to 2 light bands using a monochromatic light and an optical flat. 1.32 min video on using a monochromatic light and an optical flat on a seal face.  There is nothing smaller than 2 light bands and that includes a hydrogen molecule. Knowing that those faces are flat and nothing can get past them, you have to accept the fact that there's no lubricant lubricating the faces 'cause it just can't get in there.
You need to pull it all apart again and clean the seal faces with methyl hydrate and put back together.

The other suspect leak point I would check is the o-ring on the end of the pump shaft. Coolant could leak between the impeller and the shaft.

Then there's the seal point between the mechanical seal and the mechanical seal retainer. As I remember it, you heated the retainer and froze the mechanical seal then pressed it together so I'll assume you didn't put any sealer on it before assembling like RTV sealant, as per the FSM. I have a preference to Permatex High Temp RTV sealant. Never fails me and when disassembling for parts replacement, Permatex cleans off like a dream. 
A millwright will tell you that when assembling a joint like this, you need to apply the sealant to both the housing and the seal, since as you press the parts together, the sealant will be pressed out of the area you're trying to seal. if you were to put the sealant on just the seal and press it in the housing, the sealant would never get in to the area you're trying to seal because the edge of the housing would scrape the sealant off.
Good luck.
KB


 

Thank you KB.

Still think I'll purchase 2 new seals from 2 vendors mentioned above. Have access to mono C light and optical flats. Would be interesting to see just how 'flat' both surfaces are between both sets. And make physical  measurements of each seal. Just for science.

This gets me to wondering. Like an OD mic, both spindle and anvil must be parallel. Unlike an OD mic, the seal, if one surface (fixed) isn't parallel, the other (rotating) surface must adjust, via spring or coolant pressure, to ensure adequate seating and no leakage. How does one verify both seal surfaces are parallel when one is fixed, pressed into block, the other 'floating' via spring and coolant pressure when engine is warm? I would think a certain number of degree offset would be 'compensated' but after that? I can't think of any way to measure that.

O-Ring is new, but that doesn't mean squat, as per your info above. Just like the circlip, new doesn't mean correct.

I did not heat the retainer or freeze the mechanical seal then press together. Nor did I use Permatex or my favorite bonding agent when pressing the backside into the block.

Fortunately, it rained all day today (we need the water!) so I haven't been dwelling or working on this. Sometimes, my perfectionist OCD kicks in, then it's all I can think of.. resulting in over-thinking and blindness to <not seen to me> apparent clues/facts.

Thank you again. Sincerely.




 

Don wrote "I did not heat the retainer or freeze the mechanical seal then press together. Nor did I use Permatex or my favorite bonding agent when pressing the backside into the block."

Sorry about the comment re- heating the seal retainer cooling the seal. I know I read it somewhere in the last 2 weeks and "recalled it" in my brain. I must have been someone else. I know it stopped me to ponder why someone would do that.

No sealant between the seal housing and the cylinder block?  There's your leak. The impeller cavity has several leak points of which that interface is one of.

Kawboy wrote:

No sealant between the seal housing and the cylinder block?  There's your leak. The impeller cavity has several leak points of which that interface is one of.
 

Given that info, I'lll not tear it down until new seals arrive. Sigh. I'm losing the time of year that's the most fun time for riding the big water heater..

Kawboy wrote:

Don wrote "I did not heat the retainer or freeze the mechanical seal then press together. Nor did I use Permatex or my favorite bonding agent when pressing the backside into the block."

Sorry about the comment re- heating the seal retainer cooling the seal. I know I read it somewhere in the last 2 weeks and "recalled it" in my brain. I must have been someone else. I know it stopped me to ponder why someone would do that.

No sealant between the seal housing and the cylinder block?  There's your leak. The impeller cavity has several leak points of which that interface is one of.


 

KB, one of us is losing our mind, and it isn't you!

Mia Kulpa...

"Put inner piece in freezer for an hour, heated aluminum outer piece to 325F in oven. 
Tapped into place using hammer and special Kawasaki fitment tool <socket>."

Are you trying to drive me insane? I figured it was easier to apologize for the comment then spend an hour looking for the information in a topic that I had read in the last week. I use the "Search Engine" on this site almost as much as I read and write on this site so it wouldn't surprise me to find that someone else did it when I thought it was you.
Sudoku and working with everyone on this site is part of my anti-dementia therapy. There's a lot of info pertaining to dementia that suggests things like Crosswords, Sudoku and memory recall have a lot to do with helping those with early Alzheimer's and dementia push off the effects of those diseases. My family almost had to have my dad locked up because of early Alzheimer's at 72, which is 5 years down the road for me. The regional police found him parked on the side of a road one day for 3 hours, so they stopped and asked him what he was doing. His answer was trying to remember where he was going and he was also not sure of where he was. One officer drove his car home and one officer drove him home in the cruiser. Then they called my sister to look into the issue. 
Thanks for the clarification. Now it's time for you to get back to work and stop that Evan's waterless coolant from pissing all over the shop floor. And don't try to tell me you're not using Evan's because I know that this comment  was you for sure !! 

Ha, trying to drive you crazy? I think I've already succeeded.

Keeping the brain active is very important for us retired old folks. It's one reason I continue to work outages at the nuke plant. Gets me out of the house, makes me more disciplined, makes me engage the cranium scareabellium to resolve both human and technical issues.

I'm going to be camping for next 9 days, so no wrench turning for awhile. Might be good for me to break away. I've made too many technical mistakes on this water pp project. Stupid stuff.