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worn cam chain idle gear, must change? HELP 5 years 11 months ago #19786

  • StanG
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It's been more than 30 years since my engineering years, so in most areas I am left with the sense and a general logical understanding rather than ability to calculate anything on paper, but I remember there were formulas for springs to calculate all aspects. Measuring, counting coils etc., would come up with curves of the spring's strength. There is one difficulty though. You'd need certain constants and one of them would be for the metal used, and you would need to know exactly what these springs are made from.
Then laboratory testing, that's another chapter.

I bet most of us are more interested in 'real life' observations what happens with what results, narrowing what works and what the working solutions are based on the experiences of thousands of people riding these bikes. Sort of like with electronics for most of us - I think this would be a good example. I don't really know which way exactly the electrons fly in a CDI or another box, but I am quite happy with knowing that in order for it to work, I need to 'connect the left wire to the pink wire, the middle to this and the other two solder together' blah blah blah. (that's a purely hypothetical virtual example).

Kawboy is right on. You need to note many variables to make a research scientific, in a lab or on the road. Air pressure, humidity, temperature, weight of the rider, wind strength and direction, and so on, on top of the history of the bike and all the gauges readings. Then test, change parameters, test, repeat... It's a daunting long process, just like Kawboy put it.

Personally, I don't think I would even feel if a bike has 5 or 10 horse power more or less, or changes 5 miles more or less before needing to fill up. In my mind, a change might be justified if it makes things easier and functionally better. Any input from anyone doing research above just riding and playing with parts, plus from those who do only just that, is a great mix. Beyond that, it's a limited numbers club of people who love engineering and reverse engineering mechanical or electrical system is their hobby and joy. I had a friend who had a few old bikes. He knew so much and was building the engines from scratch, but I had never seen him ride a bike! You know what I mean.

By the way, the engineering part in me is also always calling me and teasing, haha I'd be building and doing all sorts of things have I had the luxury of doing so. I can't help coming with ideas of improvement or doing things alternative way when working on my bike, or in general doing things in life, be it sweeping a floor or washing dishes. There is always an alternative, good or bad. My mind never sleeps in a way, haha, that's just how it works.

You have my support there Kawboy, looking forward to seeing how your project will unfold!

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worn cam chain idle gear, must change? HELP 5 years 11 months ago #19789

  • Phil
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Written by Ian Rust, an engineer who tested the force applied by the springs:

"The standard CCT spring is putting 650 grams of force on the chain at a length of 52 mm, the ZZR1100 (ZX-11) spring is putting over 1030 grams of force at the same compression with 10mm cut off, that was taken at the end of its travel which is 52mm so if your cam chain isn't that slack then more force will be applied.
Compressing the ZZR CCT by 10mm nearly doubled the force applied to 2000 grams.
The standard CCT only went up to 920 grams at 10mm compression.
Phil I would be interested in how much force you will get with a full length spring.
Think I'll stick with the standard CCT modified with a back stop."

Conclude from that what you will, but I'll be reverting back to the original CCT with a longer bolt & lock nut as recommended by Lauri who also frequents this site ;)
Only dead fish go with the flow
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worn cam chain idle gear, must change? HELP 5 years 11 months ago #19793

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Good stuff Phil!
I have my original one in perfect shape, now I know what my next little project will be!
In the meantime, I will keep the manual one I already installed.

If you, or anyone has, could you post photos of before and after?
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worn cam chain idle gear, must change? HELP 5 years 11 months ago #19807

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Lauri Nurminen quoted: "I use the original tensioner, just change the 6 mm bolt to a longer one (by approx. 15 mm). Every 2000 km or so I loosen the bolt, let the adjuster do its thing and then lock it with the longer bolt. Use nut to lock securely. The tensioner can not fail when locked in place. Costs only what longer bolt is."

Luckily I kept my original CCT too ;) I've yet to do as Lauri recommends myself but I believe this is the best course of action ;)
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worn cam chain idle gear, must change? HELP 5 years 11 months ago #19808

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I agree Phil. Sounds straight forward and bullet proof. I will post a photo when I get to doing this.

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