kz1300 banner

Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me

TOPIC: Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine?

Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine? 8 months 3 weeks ago #23061

  • Kawboy
  • Kawboy's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 2023
  • Thank you received: 549
For those following this thread and think that this is inherent to the A3 with the pulser coil set up on the left side of the crank, You really need to read through this link with the same issue only on a A5 (1983) Same problem with the 3 cap screws coming loose and chewing things up. Definitely a problem worth looking in to if you have a rattle on the left side of the crankshaft at idle.

Yaegunp's thread on pulling the starter clutch

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine? 5 months 4 weeks ago #23884

  • Kawboy
  • Kawboy's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 2023
  • Thank you received: 549
Bumping this thread to the front of the queue since this is directly related to Razmo's ignition problems.

Razmo,
How did you finally repair the timing rotor?
Is the rotor now running true? or does it have a wobble?

it's a bitch that Kawasaki used the 3 - 6mm cap screws to hold AND TIME the pulser coil rotor on the stater clutch hub. there's no boss around those cap screw holes and the mass of the rotor along withthe revs of the motor really task those 3- 6mm bolts. And the bolts that they spec have no shoulder to provide a solid surface for the holes on the pulser rotor to work against on the 6mm bolts.

Is there any way that 3 holes could be drilled into the starter clutch in between the 3 - 6mm threaded holes to locate maybe 3 - 3/16" dowel pins to locate the pulser coil on the starter clutch and then use 3 - 6mm 10.5 tensile spec allen head cap screws to hold the pulser rotor on to the starter clutch ?

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by Kawboy.

Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine? 5 months 3 weeks ago #23944

  • razmo99
  • razmo99's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Senior Sixer
  • Senior Sixer
  • Posts: 59
  • Thank you received: 13
Honestly Kawaboy, I didn't check for Wobble. My Main concern was the left and right slop and how that would affect timing. It wobbling is an oversight on my part, I will need to check that out.

You could drill out the Holes to add dowels. Not sure how this would affect the strength of the dampener. The alignment of it all would be a major concern.
Dowels would make a difference if the bolts came lose again, but they would almost be taking up the job of the grooves on the back of the dampener. (Bolts & dowels would be going through the rotor)

My opinion on this is to just stop the bolts from coming lose in the first place.
84 ZG1300
81 KZ1300-A3
83 GT550
90 GPZ900R
83 KZ550
81 KZ550(in parts)

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine? 4 months 3 weeks ago #24282

  • razmo99
  • razmo99's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Senior Sixer
  • Senior Sixer
  • Posts: 59
  • Thank you received: 13
So I Bought an oscilloscope.

As you can see one of the pickups is just barely alive(Blue) at idle. Then it disappears when I raise the revs above idle.







These photos where taken two weeks ago before going on holidays, decided to probe again to be sure as it was a bit rushed.

Sitting for two weeks she wouldn't start, let me get a good look at the pulse signals at idle.

Bike Started after draining a bit of fuel from the bowls fired right up!

What was probed?
Cylinders 1-6 igniter output.
All pickups at the connector to the igniter.

Findings.
At idle all is "normal"; all cylinders are firing.

Above idle the Brown Wire Pickup, Drops off completely. The igniter output then goes to shit. Even the pairs that are getting a signal. I think this is not a problem with the igniter as it is getting fed junk/no signal.

Just gotta go from here and play with the rotor or something.

Would really like to just bolt on a new one.

I tried using a dial gauge to check for wobble, it was all over the place. This rotor does have some battle scars, looks like some rubbing as well.

For certain the problem is with the rotor or the pickups just gotta follow it up from here.
84 ZG1300
81 KZ1300-A3
83 GT550
90 GPZ900R
83 KZ550
81 KZ550(in parts)
Attachments:

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by razmo99. Reason: English

Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine? 4 months 3 weeks ago #24283

  • Kawboy
  • Kawboy's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 2023
  • Thank you received: 549
Couple of things here.
First, nice oscilloscope. Fancy tool for a workshop but invaluable for diagnosing issues like these.
The pattern may not be as far off as you think. The Hall Effect pulser coils give off a square wave. the Manual doesn't state the dwell of the square wave and maybe if you open up the horizontal span, you'll find the square wave.


Another thought that came to mind- You mentioned rub marks on the rotor. Remember when as a Boy Scout, you had to make a navigational compass with a needle by drawing the needle across a magnet to magnetize the needle? I'm wondering if you managed to magnetize the rotor by rubbing the magnets in the Hall Effect pulser coils in 1 direction and now instead of breaking the magnetic field of the Hall Effect pulser coils, you're interfacing a magnetic rotor within the Hall Effect coils and the signal is not a clean signal.

When performing a Magnaflux inspection on a part, you have to magnetize the part then submerge the item in detection fluid and inspect with a black light for cracks. After performing the test you MUST demagnetize the item prior to putting back into service. This is done by passing the item through a magnetic field in different directions to disassociate or depolarize the molecules in the part. If you managed to magnetize the rotor, you may be able to recoup it by demagnetizing it.

First, you would have to determine if it became magnetized. You could do this by tapping with a screwdriver but only when not in the presence of the Hall coils since they are magnetized. Meaning remove the rotor before checking.
Attachments:

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by Kawboy.

Rotar Pulsing coil on Left hand side of engine? 4 months 3 weeks ago #24289

  • razmo99
  • razmo99's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Senior Sixer
  • Senior Sixer
  • Posts: 59
  • Thank you received: 13
Here are some better photos. The purple Line is the one that drops off(Brown Lead).

Tried to get a photo, but it came back before I could take it.

The purple line appears to be a weaker signal than the others.





The rotor was also taken off again, it really is in rough shape. Tried to get it in a more neutral position.

I Also found that the Harmonic Dampener/balancer has some slop where it interfaces with the pin, is the pin meant to be a Roll pin?

At this point its a faulty sensor, or something is expanding when heating up that makes it not work till everything is at the same temperature.

Next time I am working on the bike I will move the Troubled sensor to another position and see if the problem moves with it, that will confirm it as the sensor.
84 ZG1300
81 KZ1300-A3
83 GT550
90 GPZ900R
83 KZ550
81 KZ550(in parts)
Attachments:
The following user(s) said Thank You: Kawboy

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by razmo99.
Time to create page: 0.097 seconds
Powered by Kunena Forum